Author |
Message |
J.REEVES
Joined: Mon Nov 05, 2007 1:09 pm Posts: 2750 Location: Newcastle
|
Re: Forces produced by a WDH
Hi Odzi, Just like to point out the graphic I posted is a standard document which can be found on the net. Your calculations look good to me and as Ozjohn pointed out when on a rough road the twisting force could be much more at times. A vehicle with a good chassis and van with a good draw bar should handle all those forces. There are thousands of people out there that have never had a problem with their van or vehicle when using a WDH. JR
|
Sat Aug 27, 2011 5:34 pm |
|
|
Quietguy
Joined: Sun Jan 29, 2012 8:58 am Posts: 2
|
Re: Forces produced by a WDH
ozjohn wrote: Like Hillbilly says, A WDH cannot alter the Ball Weight. The Ball Weight can on altered by adding or removing weight. 120Kg added to the ball will still be 120Kg when a WDH is applied. However the forces between the coupling and the ball will be increased with the application of a WDH, Cheers, Ozjohn. While I wouldn't wish to dispute your expertise, I remember someone did a test weighing a van and car with and without the weight dist hitch. IIRC their figures showed that with the WDH there was an increase of weight on the vans. As this added weight has to come from somewhere, wouldn't it come from a reduction in the weight applied to the tow ball? Just looking to clear up my confusion, as my expertise is VERY limited David
|
Fri Apr 20, 2012 10:57 am |
|
|
ozjohn
Joined: Tue Oct 02, 2007 5:23 pm Posts: 2358 Location: Mornington Peninsula - Vic
|
Re: Forces produced by a WDH
The weight added to the van wheels and the front wheels of the tow vehicle have been distibuted from the rear axle of the tow vehicle. Hence the name "Weight Distribution Hitch". OJ
_________________ Holden 2.8 Colorado- 17'6" Roma Elegance Pop Top. Retired Engineer - Ex Caravan Consultant and Park Owner. ACC - V00118
|
Fri Apr 20, 2012 11:08 am |
|
|
hillbilly123
Joined: Sun Jul 26, 2009 4:52 pm Posts: 2033 Location: Near Brisbane
|
Re: Forces produced by a WDH
Quietguy wrote: ozjohn wrote: Like Hillbilly says, A WDH cannot alter the Ball Weight. The Ball Weight can on altered by adding or removing weight. 120Kg added to the ball will still be 120Kg when a WDH is applied. However the forces between the coupling and the ball will be increased with the application of a WDH, Cheers, Ozjohn. While I wouldn't wish to dispute your expertise, I remember someone did a test weighing a van and car with and without the weight dist hitch. IIRC their figures showed that with the WDH there was an increase of weight on the vans. As this added weight has to come from somewhere, wouldn't it come from a reduction in the weight applied to the tow ball? Just looking to clear up my confusion, as my expertise is VERY limited David If you read my earlier post you would have seen that I said that THE BALLWEIGHT IS WEIGHED WITH THE VAN DISCONNECTED FROM THE TUG. That is the figure you work with Whether you use a WDH or a rolling jack underneath it That is the weight. By using a WDH you straighten the joint between the vehicles and thereby DISTRIBUTE some weight back onto the front wheel and also the van wheels. However as a manufacturer doesnt know what the owner is going to do with the vehicle you must stick to the weighed weight. A WDH does NOT LESSEN ballweight it alters the position of some of it but the amount of weight is still the same. IE You cannot have a vehicle with 250kg allowance and hook up a van with 275kg and pull up the WDH and say that it is now 250 cos some is shifted. The man in uniform, if he knows his rules may say OK unhook it and we will weigh it properly. You will be stuffed
|
Fri Apr 20, 2012 2:29 pm |
|
|
PeterD
Joined: Thu Feb 28, 2008 5:38 pm Posts: 1870 Location: Chain Valley Bay, near Newcastle
|
Re: Forces produced by a WDH
Quietguy wrote: . . . I remember someone did a test weighing a van and car with and without the weight dist hitch. IIRC their figures showed that with the WDH there was an increase of weight on the vans. As this added weight has to come from somewhere, wouldn't it come from a reduction in the weight applied to the tow ball?
Just looking to clear up my confusion, as my expertise is VERY limited - David The only way you can remove weight from the tow coupling is to redistribute the load in your van. Anything you do with WDH just redistributes the load carried on the wheels. When you tension the bars you tilt the tug forward a whisker and puts more weight on the front wheels. As well the back end of the bars pull down on the A frame and place some of the ball weight on the vans wheels. This has been posted previously, looks like it is time to refresh peoples minds. http://www.rv.net/FORUM/index.cfm/fusea ... 265335.cfm
_________________ PeterD Retired radio & electronics technician - Nissan Navara D40 diesel auto (pensioners pack) towing a Spaceland pop-top
|
Fri Apr 20, 2012 7:47 pm |
|
|
hillbilly123
Joined: Sun Jul 26, 2009 4:52 pm Posts: 2033 Location: Near Brisbane
|
Re: Forces produced by a WDH
hillbilly123 wrote: Quietguy wrote: ozjohn wrote: Like Hillbilly says, A WDH cannot alter the Ball Weight. The Ball Weight can on altered by adding or removing weight. 120Kg added to the ball will still be 120Kg when a WDH is applied. However the forces between the coupling and the ball will be increased with the application of a WDH, Cheers, Ozjohn. While I wouldn't wish to dispute your expertise, I remember someone did a test weighing a van and car with and without the weight dist hitch. IIRC their figures showed that with the WDH there was an increase of weight on the vans. As this added weight has to come from somewhere, wouldn't it come from a reduction in the weight applied to the tow ball? Just looking to clear up my confusion, as my expertise is VERY limited David If you read my earlier post you would have seen that I said that THE BALLWEIGHT IS WEIGHED WITH THE VAN DISCONNECTED FROM THE TUG. That is the figure you work with Whether you use a WDH or a rolling jack underneath it That is the weight. By using a WDH you straighten the joint between the vehicles and thereby DISTRIBUTE some weight back onto the front wheel and also the van wheels. However as a manufacturer doesnt know what the owner is going to do with the vehicle you must stick to the weighed weight. A WDH does NOT LESSEN ballweight it alters the position of some of it but the amount of weight is still the same. IE You cannot have a vehicle with 250kg allowance and hook up a van with 275kg and pull up the WDH and say that it is now 250 cos some is shifted. The man in uniform, if he knows his rules may say OK unhook it and we will weigh it properly. You will be stuffed To add to this if a manufacturer states a certain ballweight on a vehicle It is the weight WITHOUT any additions of WDH or anything. That therefore is what you adhere to. The only way to lessen the ball weight is as said redistribute the load in the van Usually to your detriment if too much is placed rearward. The only other way to lighten it that I can think of is to get a very very big balloon filled with helium or similar and attach that to A frame. Alternatively a skyhook would help.
|
Fri Apr 20, 2012 8:23 pm |
|
|
odzi
Joined: Thu Aug 25, 2011 1:23 pm Posts: 315 Location: Melbourne Eastern Suburbs
|
Re: Forces produced by a WDH
I'll go with Hillbilly's option of a helium balloon as that would be a lot more fun at Happy Hour as well
_________________ Experienced in travel, but still a beginner when it comes to a caravan Up front: 2011 Nissan X-Trail 4 x 4 Behind: Rental van. We were thinking about our own A'van Cruiser or maybe a Windsor Little Shuttle instead but now a Jayco Freedom is our favourite!
|
Sun Apr 29, 2012 7:57 am |
|
|
billy the kid
Joined: Sun Dec 14, 2008 5:10 pm Posts: 336 Location: RavenswoodWA(near mandurah)
|
Re: Forces produced by a WDH
I was watching a Gall boys video last night where they were on Fraser island towing their offroad van on the sand tracks with their wdh still attached!!!. Of course the inevitable happened.The driver (david gall) drove through a deep dip in the track and the downward force on the tow bar ripped it right off.The gall boys are completely devoid of any common sense , especially the afore-mentioned driver.
|
Sun Apr 29, 2012 12:12 pm |
|
|
Hugh Jarse
Joined: Tue Jun 15, 2010 11:19 am Posts: 56 Location: Mareeba Qld
|
Re: Forces produced by a WDH
Hi all
Whilst I didn't want to start a new thread as my question relates to WDH's, my question is this: when I hook up my WDH I run it fourth link from the top on both sides. One side requires the lever to lock it up, the other side I can do with my hand and the bar swings in the breeze. Is this a normal state of affairs?
Cheers
|
Mon Mar 10, 2014 11:28 am |
|
|
Old Techo
Joined: Fri Dec 26, 2008 1:23 pm Posts: 7018 Location: Melbourne
|
Re: Forces produced by a WDH
When the tug and van are directly in line the bar loads should be equal. As the tug/van angle changes in a left or right turn the outside bar carries much more load as the bar pivot points are canted.
I posted here about a technique I advised where the bars can be removed without any tool simply by turning a little in one direction, remove the unloaded inside bar, then turn the other way for the other bar. It doesn't take much turn angle to unload the inside bar.
_________________ Regards, Old Techo 2007 Prado Diesel Auto 2004 Roadstar Limited Edition
|
Mon Mar 10, 2014 12:12 pm |
|
|